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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2015 22:54:39 GMT -5
cait not only are you delirious about racing in md., but i think you are definately delirious on how others see the situation. outside of yourself, ev, and RG, (the three amigos!) all of whom i adore by the way, and of curse jon by default (that ball and chain can be very heavy at times!) i dont think a whole lot of other people would agree with you on your comparison of md. racing with other venues. regardless of your PERSONAL reasons for disliking del mar, if you really believe pimlico is on par with them, well, you are just...................
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2015 23:05:01 GMT -5
i didnt say it was official. but as i said, they advertise it that way and if you asked 10 average joe race goers from around the country, nine out of the ten would think that the black eyed susan is part of the filly tc, official or not. The first time I heard anything about these three races being linked (actually confused because NYRA has two races that have been linked to it!) was three or four years ago. I suspect it was a TVG/ADW marketing scheme, not necessarily the tracks themselves. But, in looking for the "history" of the three races, and the other two or three races in NY, I checked a few horses that have run in some of the races. The most impressive (at least from those I looked at) was Davona Dale - Calumet Farm / John Veitch, the Alydar connections. She ran in and won the Kentucky Oaks, Black-Eyed Susan, Acorn, Mother Goose, CCAO, all in the course of only eight weeks! She took a month off and then finished second in the Alabama and fourth in the Travers seven days later. Now THAT is how to train and race a horse. well george, all i know is i have been going to the races for approximately 35 of my 43 years and i can remember my father, uncle, and evryone else i knew interested in racing always referring to the black eyed susan as the fillies version of the preakness and second leg of the filly tc. now the tiara thing i had heard of also, but to me that was always more of a ny thing, not national. just like during the del mar meet on the turf when they run the oceanside, la jolla (?), and del mar derby. they are linked together, but not on a national level. also like the malibu, san fernando, and strub used to be for 4 yr. olds at santa anita back in their hey day.
man i miss those days. that was a great series before they ruined it.
1987 strub stakes.............best horse race of all time in my book, along with the 1989 preakness.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 0:03:56 GMT -5
i didnt say it was official. but as i said, they advertise it that way and if you asked 10 average joe race goers from around the country, nine out of the ten would think that the black eyed susan is part of the filly tc, official or not. The first time I heard anything about these three races being linked (actually confused because NYRA has two races that have been linked to it!) was three or four years ago. I suspect it was a TVG/ADW marketing scheme, not necessarily the tracks themselves. But, in looking for the "history" of the three races, and the other two or three races in NY, I checked a few horses that have run in some of the races. The most impressive (at least from those I looked at) was Davona Dale - Calumet Farm / John Veitch, the Alydar connections. She ran in and won the Kentucky Oaks, Black-Eyed Susan, Acorn, Mother Goose, CCAO, all in the course of only eight weeks! She took a month off and then finished second in the Alabama and fourth in the Travers seven days later. Now THAT is how to train and race a horse. why the long layoff between the CCAO and the ALABAMA?
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 0:18:02 GMT -5
I think the wiz is correct about the race being irrelevant. If macdaddy thinks that a horse that ran two races in life - a MSW and a ALW at the FG in mediocre times against mediocre horses, is going to demolish the field in the Black Eye Susan (and he may be right), then yes it must be an irrelevant race. lol. Personally I have not looked at all the PP's yet of the horses in the race so I do not know myself. Give me a few minutes and I will get back with you on the winner. lol. im not doubting the horse will win or is a good horse, and have no problem with the class hike. it is perfectly in line and maybe not even enough of a class hike since the black eyed susan's field strength usually equates to that of an optional claimer at most major tracks. i havent looked at the race either thogh, and probably wont. i mean, why bother?
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Jon
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Post by Jon on May 12, 2015 0:29:14 GMT -5
Damn Wiz - No "ball and chain" here. You been reading the trash site? LOL I will say that I think you 2 are hilarious, I also think Cait's right, MD racing is better than it's been in years. There was a lot of press about all the good things happening there. Have been to both tracks and while Laurel is suburban, lots of land surrounding it, no neighborhood, Pimlico is in a "working class neighborhood" but that's not the same as "the slums". I also noticed a lot of security. My wife's right that the people were great - not at all like the abrasive NY track staffs. It was "an enhanced experience" LOL
This winter, when Laurel raced, weather permitting, the fields and betting were good. Lots of shippers, some great prices. It was better, IMO, than NY and SA/LA and sometimes better than the "winter tracks" - GP, FG, OP.
It's old. So am I. You just want to shoot "old" LOL But I find a lot of west coasters have no appreciation of history. MD has a very rich thoro history and it does seem to be on the upswing after a decline when Stronach took over. A decline that wouldn't have happened had he gotten slots. On the flip side, he's been a cash lifeline for SA. I also think CA racing, except for big days, has declined. That's expected as no purse boost from slots, and too many big purses in the East so no reason to ship to the West Coast. I agree that Del Mar on days without a big race has horrible fields. Maybe it will be different with dirt.
It's all about $. Just the way it is.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 0:42:28 GMT -5
Wiz - you are the one arguing - once again you know NOTHING about racing here - AND YOU ARE THE MOST BIASED POSTER ON THIS BOARD & CAN'T ADMIT IT - you really believe your opinions are facts because you said so - they're not - Fairplex? nope - that would be the day to day (not the few big race days) racing at Delmar lol you just keep on posting your crap about ny and md and everywhere else - you rarely say anything good about anything anyway- except yourself of course lol you are the friggin' instigator 98% of the time - then somewhere you whined that I was dissing some horse because you liked it (wasn't true) but all you ever do is diss md - read some trades and educate yourself before posting your stupid uniformed stuff poor l'il wizzie - dishes it out constantly but can't handle getting some back or anyone disagreeing with his OPINIONS nick - ahh chocolate's a nice horse so far - there's a whole thread somewhere about her - got a late start I think so now i only say good things about myself? like what cait? do i ever tout horses on here or brag about how much i win or lose? no. in fact the only time i even mention anything along those lines is when it is part of a story or when someone calls me out on it. who is the one getting personal now? sounds like you, the one who is usually crying about it when no one has even done anything. i think what you are referring to is when i said that the belmont may be the time to bet danzig moon because you said you WONT be betting him because of leparoux. MUSH off i said. nothing to do with me. just you possibly being bad luck and now not betting a horse when it actually figures to possibly have a chance now. unlike its previous race where you said you liked the horse when it looked like one of the worst in the field. educate myself on what cait? once again, on your opinions of the complex and area? of your opinions on the strength of the horses there? i can read cait and i can see. your reasons for liking it and defending it are the personal ones. i am basing my disrespect and dislike of it based on facts and what i see in articles, pictures, and news, and also recent happenings in the surrounding areas. do i know for sure there will be a riot or trouble there on saturday? no, of course not, and i hope there isnt. but you seem to be awful confident that there wont be . and based on what? also isnt it interesting that everytime i post something, you dispute it. then someone agrees with me or backs up what i say and then you are silent. where are the accusations of bias towards others when they share the same opinions that i have? poor lil wizzie cant take it? am i the one crying to stop? am i the one complaining when you dispute what i say? nope. i just repost and show either the facts or at least an honest, educated, and fair opinion of the situation. not just the way i want others to see it.
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Jon
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Post by Jon on May 12, 2015 0:49:45 GMT -5
Wiz - Sorry Man but your opinions aren't always based on facts LOL Have no idea what articles you have been reading about MD racing but mostly the press has been positive. Not taking sides but she has more factual info than you on this subject. As to anything else - well - that's just you 2 LOL
Also think many agree with you because they fear you - well - not the NY Gals - LMAO See no one trashing MD racing except you. Many of us trash NY because, well, it's quite trashable and will remain so until Cuomo gets his manicured little fingers out of it!
If it rains (a maybe at this time) Danzig Moon is a play.
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Post by Jon on May 12, 2015 0:59:00 GMT -5
FTR - MY opinions LOL The ball and chain comment not only sucked, it's untrue. Ask RG!
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 1:30:13 GMT -5
Damn Wiz - No "ball and chain" here. You been reading the trash site? LOL I will say that I think you 2 are hilarious, I also think Cait's right, MD racing is better than it's been in years. There was a lot of press about all the good things happening there. Have been to both tracks and while Laurel is suburban, lots of land surrounding it, no neighborhood, Pimlico is in a "working class neighborhood" but that's not the same as "the slums". I also noticed a lot of security. My wife's right that the people were great - not at all like the abrasive NY track staffs. It was "an enhanced experience" LOL This winter, when Laurel raced, weather permitting, the fields and betting were good. Lots of shippers, some great prices. It was better, IMO, than NY and SA/LA and sometimes better than the "winter tracks" - GP, FG, OP. It's old. So am I. You just want to shoot "old" LOL But I find a lot of west coasters have no appreciation of history. MD has a very rich thoro history and it does seem to be on the upswing after a decline when Stronach took over. A decline that wouldn't have happened had he gotten slots. On the flip side, he's been a cash lifeline for SA. I also think CA racing, except for big days, has declined. That's expected as no purse boost from slots, and too many big purses in the East so no reason to ship to the West Coast. I agree that Del Mar on days without a big race has horrible fields. Maybe it will be different with dirt. It's all about $. Just the way it is. you know the ball and chain comment was a joke.
you are wrong about me having no appreciation of history or just shooting down "old" just to do it. quite the contrary. i love racing history and respect many of the older horsemen. hell whittingham was the best trainer i ever saw, and still was into his 60's and 70's. same with pincay when he was older as a jockey. but history, the majority of the time, has a place................ in history. just because something was once great doesnt mean it still is and doesnt mean it still has a place in modern and current times. it might, but it might not. this place doesnt. again, so what if he had gotten slots? a quick fix but not a problem solver. if del mar is so bad jon, then please just explain thiese things to me. we wont even get into attendance because that isnt even in the same realm, although you will bring the nonsensical argument that the del mar crowd is full of newbies. so what as long as they are betting and buying refeshments and keeping the place solvent and a money maker. but lets talk betting. if del mar is so bad, why do people bet it? is it my supposed bias for ca. that is making joe blow, sitting in a simulcast facility in wyoming, play del mar instead of md. racing? compare the handle. compare the attendance. numbers speak for themselves. outside of saratoga there is no more succesful meet run in the country. why is that if the racing and horses are so bad?
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 1:41:22 GMT -5
Wiz - Sorry Man but your opinions aren't always based on facts LOL Have no idea what articles you have been reading about MD racing but mostly the press has been positive. Not taking sides but she has more factual info than you on this subject. As to anything else - well - that's just you 2 LOL Also think many agree with you because they fear you - well - not the NY Gals - LMAO See no one trashing MD racing except you. Many of us trash NY because, well, it's quite trashable and will remain so until Cuomo gets his manicured little fingers out of it! If it rains (a maybe at this time) Danzig Moon is a play. fear me? why? am i holding a handgun to someones head in here? am i online making threats or looking up ip addresses? thats bullshit and you know it.
also this wasnt meant to be or started out as me trying to trash md. racing. all i said was the black eyed susan is an irrelevant race on the the national scene and it elevated from there due to caits insistance that nothing associated with her sweet little maryland track can be put in a negative light. im not trying to trash md. racing because there is no need to. other then one weekend a year, most players dont even know it exists anymore to be truthful. if they want to run their little second and third rate meets there, by all means go ahead. but when you start trying to compare it to major racing facilities and top quality racing that is where i have to say something.
i dont think danzig moon is a play anyway because i just dont think he is good enough. my only point was that if you liked him before the derby, how can you not give him a chance after the derby? he definately an better in the derby then he has in any race leading up to it and had a very troubled trip. her reasoning for not liking him is what doesnt make sense to me, and it gives the horse an extra little boost to know that if you are playing him, you no longer have a black cat on his back.
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Jon
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Post by Jon on May 12, 2015 2:00:08 GMT -5
Don't like Leparoux on dirt either. But Preakness not a jock's race as much as Derby is. All I meant was Malibu Moon's do OK on a wet track - if it rains. Now that Mr Z's out, AP wins LOL
Not rehashing Del Mar racing with you. Big crowds as it's a beautiful track. Hopefully better racing with dirt.
So you can both be pissed at me LOL OK NBD
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 10:57:42 GMT -5
She ran in and won the Kentucky Oaks, Black-Eyed Susan, Acorn, Mother Goose, CCAO, all in the course of only eight weeks! She took a month off and then finished second in the Alabama and fourth in the Travers seven days later. Now THAT is how to train and race a horse. why the long layoff between the CCAO and the ALABAMA? There may not have been a suitable race for her?
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 12:11:14 GMT -5
theres always timonium, home of the premier thoroughbred meet.
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cait
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Post by cait on May 12, 2015 14:29:55 GMT -5
theres always timonium, home of the premier thoroughbred meet. there ya have it - he may think he's a terminator - merely an instigator - like a mosquito lol and btw mr i'mneverwrong wiz - some of us work - 1 reason not to reply and the best reason - why bother reply to pure stupid bs? (such as the above) Timonium is equal to dm - the fair circuit lol
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 14:55:10 GMT -5
For some reason this song keeps coming to mind:
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 15:42:24 GMT -5
theres always timonium, home of the premier thoroughbred meet. there ya have it - he may think he's a terminator - merely an instigator - like a mosquito lol and btw mr i'mneverwrong wiz - some of us work - 1 reason not to reply and the best reason - why bother reply to pure stupid bs? (such as the above) Timonium is equal to dm - the fair circuit lol what the hell are you talking about? man you really get off topic and side step into stuff that makes no sense. when did i say anything about you not working or having time to reply? are you on meds? did you forget to take them? bbviously if your comparing pimlico and now timonium to del mar they must be some very heavy narcotics.
only one that thinks im a terminator must be you. i know ive never made any claim like that.
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Post by Evelyn on May 14, 2015 22:33:24 GMT -5
I've always liked Jones. He seems like a good man and is a good trainer - especially with fillies. Jones returns to Old Hilltop for Black-Eyed Susan Day Brisnet Trainer Larry Jones' enthusiasm for his sport and his job are unfettered -- an amazing thing, really, when you think about the man. He has had wondrous successes, yes; but cruel turns of fate, as well. "I'm back," he said. "I had died. That's what they told me, but I don't remember it." Jones will be at Pimlico this weekend to run four-year-old filly Blue Violet (Curlin) in the $150,000 Allaire DuPont Distaff S. (G3) and three-year-old Divine Dawn (Divine Park) in the $150,000 Miss Preakness S. (G3), each part of Friday's 14-race Black-Eyed Susan Day program. If he continues to feel well, Jones may stick around Saturday as well, as he might have a horse running on the undercard of the 140th Preakness S. (G1). Jones has a history in the middle jewel of the Triple Crown, finishing third with Kentucky Derby runner-up Hard Spun in 2007 and 10th with Friesen Fire in 2009. "Lord willing, I'll stay for Saturday," he said. "That's the plan." In this latest return, Jones, 58, is back from a terrible fall he took on Easter weekend, April 19, 2014. The morning before the holiday, he was riding his two-year-old trainee, Atta Boy Ace (Proud Citizen), and the horse got startled on the way back to the barn. He began bucking and Jones, after what he thinks had been a pretty strong ride, finally flew off and landed on his head. His wife, Cindy, found him face down in the dirt. Jones knows all this because he's been told by his wife. He doesn't remember any of it. "The fall did about kill me," Jones said. "But, God had a hand in this. And it was Easter Sunday in the hospital. It's not the biggest miracle ever done on Easter." On that Saturday, right after the fall, hospital tests showed massive bleeding on his brain and between the brain and skull. The next day, tests done moments before he was about to be taken to surgery showed no blood. The operation was canceled. "I'm not saying it was or wasn't a miracle," Jones said. "But, I know God had his hand on it." Jones is still coping with the aftermath of the fall, in which he suffered crack ribs, a fractured wrist and bruised lung, and recurring bouts of dizziness. As the travels this comeback trail, he continues to put much faith in God. Jones couldn't do much of anything for five weeks after the fall, and when he came back to the racetrack and considered getting back up on his exercise pony, he realized he was afraid. At 6-feet and 180 pounds, Jones is one of few trainers who actually rides his horses during workouts and if he was afraid to mount the pony, it would change much of the way he ran his operation. "I had so much dizziness," he explained. "Five weeks and it still wasn't gone. It was hard enough walking in a straight line and I was afraid. "But God tapped me on the shoulder and said, 'Fear not. Get back on the horse.' Well, do you live it or just talk it? So I got on the horse and the dizziness went away. "An hour after I got off the horse, it came back and I thought, 'Well, if I ride for 23 hours a day, I'll be OK," he laughed. "But, it kept getting better. I'm good now, but if I go two or three days without riding the dizziness still comes back. It's strange, but it's all in God's hand." He still has some trouble coping in crowds and he's cut his work day back significantly. "My crew still says I'm not right," he said. "But life goes on and as far as training the horses, that's OK. I just don't multi-task well now. This is the toughest deal I've ever had. It put the skids on me." Coming back from the fall hasn't been like coming back from his year of retirement in 2010, though that too was brought on by an illness -- one most people weren't aware of. He had been through a difficult time in 2008, as his wonderful filly Eight Belles was euthanized almost immediately after finishing second in the Kentucky Derby. She had freakishly broken both front ankles while galloping out after crossing the finish line and couldn't stand. There was no choice in what to do. She could not be saved. Jones was tormented by the loss of the filly, hounded by the media afterward, and contemplated retiring then, but he said when he finally put the training operations in the hands of his wife and stepped away, it was not because of the Eight Belles episode. "The media constantly bugging you doesn't help," he admitted. "But Eight Belles wasn't the reason, to be honest. I wasn't remembering things. It was discovered that I had a high amount of aluminum in my body. A side effect of that is Alzheimer's. I thought I was going crazy and I didn't want to go nuts in front of the general public. So I retired and it gave me time to detox the aluminum out. That was the big reason for my quitting. When I came back from that, I was feeling pretty good." A year after the retirement, his wife said she wasn't enjoying training the horses, either, and they thought about what to do. Owner Rick Porter was trying to persuade them to take his filly Havre de Grace and they decided to stick with the business, but downsize their operation, cutting their 100 horses to 55. Under Jones' guidance Havre de Grace became Horse of the Year in 2011, one of many filly success stories Jones has written over the past eight years or so. Besides Eight Belles there were Proud Spell, who won the Kentucky Oaks (G1) in 2008 and would go on to be honored as that year's champion three-year-old filly; Believe You Can, who captured the 2012 Kentucky Oaks; and Payton d'Oro (Medaglia d'Oro), who triumphed in the 2009 Black-Eyed Susan S. (G2). Earlier this month, Jones won his third Kentucky Oaks with Lovely Maria (Majesticperfection) while also training third-place finisher I'm a Chatterbox (Munnings). "The only surprise there was that we weren't first and second," Jones said. "I guess that win is my biggest since returning from the fall." Asked if the latest Oaks win has special significance after returning from his fall, Jones thought for a moment and then said he sees every day as special. "As I've been told, I died (during) the MRI," he said. "Every day after that is a blessing." Larry Jones has overcome numerous health scares over the past few years with wife, Cindy, by his side (Bob Newell/Horsephotos.com)
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Post by Evelyn on May 15, 2015 16:16:24 GMT -5
I got home just in time to see this (so much for taking off today!) Quite an upset. Thanks to CC, I had her in my box but not with include Betty - think CC wheeled her in the Preakness double? Congrats to Stonestreet. They deserve a big win as they put so much into racing. Mack - I stayed with Ahh Chocolate who went way wide but I don't know that she would have moved up from 3rd. Castellano rode a perfect race setting the right slow splits.
Keen Pauline Upsets Black-Eyed Susan By Claire Novak
Stonestreet Stables' homebred Keen Pauline upset the $250,000 Black-Eyed Susan Stakes (gr. II) May 15, showing the way throughout and drawing off in the stretch to earn her biggest career victory at Pimlico Race Course.
A 15-1 shot who only had a maiden score from last September under her belt, the 3-year-old Pulpit filly improved off a fourth-place finish in a six-furlong allowance sprint April 16 at Keeneland for trainer Dale Romans and aced her first attempt at the 1 1/8-mile distance.
Javier Castellano rode the chestnut filly to victory in a final time of 1:50.40 on a fast track, two lengths ahead of Include Betty who closed to grab second, while Ahh Chocolate was third. Luminance, favored at 6-5, was in contention early, but faded to finish off the board.
Keen Pauline, bred in Kentucky out of the Two Punch mare Grand Pauline, returned $32.80, $10.80, and $5.80.
This story will be updated.
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Post by mackdaddy on May 15, 2015 21:12:44 GMT -5
Ahh Chocolate will be back. She ran 3rd in a Grade 3 in her 3Rd start. Very proud of her and Hernandez. Castellano walked the dog in the race. She can go 1 1/4 and honestly I don't give a crap what anyone thinks. Roll Tide! She will go to Saratoga in the you know what.
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Jon
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Post by Jon on May 16, 2015 1:25:34 GMT -5
So much for the fear factor the press went nuts about. Saw no reports of any incidents.
'Susan' Day Handle, Attendance Well Up Bloodhorse
The Maryland Jockey Club announced that the total handle for its May 15 card at Pimlico Race Course, which featured the Black-Eyed Susan (gr. II), was $18.5 million, the highest total handle for the card in 10 years and topping last year's handle of $11.3 million by 63%.
The $18.5 million total handle on Friday's 14-race card also topped 2013's total handle of $12.5 million.
Total attendance was 42,700, compared with last year's total attendance of 34,736, an increase of 23%, the MJC said.
"Black-Eyed Susan Day was a tremendous success," said MJC vice president and general manager Sal Sinatra. "From early this morning to this evening, our fans celebrated a great day of racing, the strength and spirit of women, and some amazing performances by our equine and human athletes.
"None of this is possible without our great fans, our horsemen, and the city of Baltimore. We look forward to an exciting 140th Preakness Saturday."
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