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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 18:47:19 GMT -5
not princess of sylmar!!
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Post by shooter29 on Nov 1, 2013 19:15:30 GMT -5
IMO it'll be a close vote. I don't think it's in the bag for either Beholder or Princess. It will come down to whether the voters put more stock in one race (The Distaff) or the totality of each horse's body of work.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 19:41:11 GMT -5
This isn't going to be an easy one, and no matter who gets it, lots of people will be unhappy.
By the numbers:
Princess of Sylmar
8 6 1 0 $1,539,000
Beholder
6 4 2 0 $1,860,000
Princess of Sylmar won their only matchup on "neutral" ground.
Looks like deja vu all over again - who had the most ambitious campaign, who faced the tougher overall competition, etc.? Is one clunker inconclusive?
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Post by shooter29 on Nov 1, 2013 20:07:11 GMT -5
It'll be a controversial vote no matter which way it goes. For Beholder's part, a lot of discussion about the fact that she went head over heels before the start of the KY Oaks and what effect that may have had on her final performance. I don't know how this will play out in the minds of the voters yet, but it will be interesting to say the least.
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Post by Evelyn on Nov 1, 2013 20:08:16 GMT -5
Why not? All 4 of Beholder's G1's have been at SA. Princess also has 4 G1's - at 3 different tracks. Beholder was on her home track on a very biased track. Today's souped up speedway was a major disappointment. I don't think any of these races, BC or not, should be the primary basis for any year end awards. I wonder if it holds for tomorrow will it help Ft L or Dude most? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 20:13:44 GMT -5
The ONLY reason Princess beat Beholder is she was a mess before the race. Shooter mentioned that, she dumped GoGo and still ran a huge 2nd in the Oaks.
Stop with this neutral site stuff. A race is a race. You either win or lose.
Pres
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Post by Evelyn on Nov 1, 2013 20:23:48 GMT -5
Disagree completely Pres
Beholderand GOD both need to prove (to me anyway) they can win G1's outside of CA.
Home tracks, familiar surfaces, not traveling 3000 miles are all huge advantages.
The good news is when Princess has a great 2014 she'll hopefully shun the BC because it's at SA - again. Hopefully the clowns in charge of the BC will get the message.
Honestly, I've lost interest in tomorrow. Play the hometown speed. End of story.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 20:29:37 GMT -5
Evelyn:
If you have such dislike for SA why even bother playing the races?? If Princess had won you'd be lavishing praise all over you're forum.
She wasn't good enough to win today, plain and simple. Your OBVIOUS bias is certainly for all to see. Yet you continue to blast me when I take a shot at Pletcher or NY Racing. What's the difference in what you're doing and what I'm doing??
Pres
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Post by shooter29 on Nov 1, 2013 20:34:04 GMT -5
Ev, you make a good case when comparing the overall 2013 records of Princess and Beholder. Personally, I prefer the horse who has danced every dance. The KY Oaks, CCA Oaks, Alabama and Beldame trump the Las Virgenes, SA Oaks, Zenyatta and Distaff. But I of course don't get a vote so we'll just have to see how things shake out. For the record, Beholder would be the first 2YO Champion Filly to win honors at age 3 since Silverbulletday in '98-'99.
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Post by Evelyn on Nov 1, 2013 20:39:29 GMT -5
Pres - The "obvious bias" is the SA track surface. Very different. You attack on a personal level with no factual back-up.
Yes - Princess and every other come from behind horse was not "good enough" on that track on this day. Bet even Zenyatta would have lost!
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Post by Evelyn on Nov 1, 2013 20:45:22 GMT -5
Shooter - I agree completely. What I'm saying is year end awards should not be doled out to BC winners. They are supposed to be based on the year's campaign.
It's looking good for Flashy tomorrow though! LOL
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 20:47:57 GMT -5
He are the FACTS Pletcher didn't win 1 BC Race today. His record in these races is HORRIBLE. His record in Triple Crown Races is awful.
Shall I continue to state facts?
Excuse me I have to go study for Saturday, first thing I do is draw a line through C.Brown,Baffert and Pletchers Horses.
Makes my handicapping so much easier.
Pres
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2013 21:01:01 GMT -5
No one seems to mention that Princess of Sylmar stumbled badly out of the gate. And as Evelyn points out, if you weren't near the lead on the dirt today, you were going nowhere. It looked like they moved the dirt races a mile north to the Foothill Freeway.
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Post by shooter29 on Nov 1, 2013 21:29:04 GMT -5
I think it's pretty obvious after all the hand-wringing after the Eastern horses dominated on last year's sanded-down surface, that track officials have decided to accommodate the local horsemen. Aside from the Mar athon which as I said earlier is a war of attrition, nobody was making up any ground today on the main track. Look for that trend to favor the Cali speedballs tomorrow as well.
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