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Post by hesnotmypres on May 11, 2014 17:34:07 GMT -5
How did Pletcher Derby Weekend? What are his stats in the Derby? 1-40
So what he does on a Sunday MEANS NOTHING...
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2014 18:12:30 GMT -5
im not sure his owners feel that way. especially the ones who own the horses that run on sunday.
theres more to racing then just the derby.
hell im not the biggest pletcher fan either, but he deserves more respect then you give him.
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Post by hesnotmypres on May 11, 2014 18:50:06 GMT -5
Wiz when you are handed the best Horses in the Country you should win all the time.. 85% of his time is sitting behind his computer plotting where his Horses will run. His assistants are some of the best, when he wins he gives them 0 credit. He probably just is hands on 2-4% of his stable...
That's why I'm so hard on him, he's a businessman NOT a Trainer.
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2014 19:37:51 GMT -5
Pletcher had horses in three races today at Belmont Park. He won all three. He was in the winners circle for all three with his owners and jockeys.
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Post by hesnotmypres on May 11, 2014 19:47:27 GMT -5
So Todd was in the Winners Circle, big deal. Did he bring his Assistant in with him also?? After all he's the one that does 95% of the work. Pletcher is "home" so he will be there in the Afternoon. It's no shame being a businessman, that's what he is..A trainer is someone who's hands on EVERY Horse not just his stars
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Post by Evelyn on May 11, 2014 21:37:55 GMT -5
I think all trainers with big stables are businessmen. Assistants are vital but the answers to owners questions come from the trainer. I can't say who is or who isn't dooing the work but I'm sure it's more than 5%.
Since he's primarily in NY - Pres - are you saying the "best horses" are in NY? LOL
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2014 22:05:04 GMT -5
winning % has nothing to do with how many good horses you get. it has to do with what you do with the ones you have. I agree he gets a lot of good horses, and I agree in your estimation that he is NOT the best trainer out there. but he still wins a high % of his races. look at lukas. he doesn't have nearly as many expensive horses as pletcher, but that's only because he doesn't have as many total horses as pletcher. its the same ratio though. lukas doesn't even bother with anything that isn't a blue blood. he just doesn't have as many total horses. yet he cant break 10% as a trainer and hasn't for years. pletcher is consistently 25%, and that's with tha fact that he is starting multiple horses in some of these rsaces with only one chance to win, virtually guaranteeing a lower win percentage.
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Post by Evelyn on May 11, 2014 22:23:37 GMT -5
I was referring to the comment that assistants do 95% of the work.
I think the hate meter is equal Wiz/Coach & Pres/Pletcher! Oc course both are hard to measure as they are over the top LOL
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2014 22:33:19 GMT -5
mine is fact based. numbers don't lie.
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2014 22:37:50 GMT -5
Last year about half of his starters and winners were in New York at Belmont Park and Saratoga. And most of his other starters and winners were at Gulfstream Park, where he spends his winters and trains his horses at Palm Meadows. He doesn't stable many horses anywhere but in New York most of the year or Florida in the winter. Almost all horses he enters in races outside of those places are shipped in.
This silliness that Pletcher doesn't see his horses is just that - silliness. He trains his horses "hands on" almost exclusively.
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Post by Evelyn on May 11, 2014 23:10:17 GMT -5
mine is fact based. numbers don't lie. Still waiting on those #'s LOL But it has nada to do with this thread.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2014 0:09:08 GMT -5
next time you look at the pp's for any horse lukas trains, look at the number next to his name. you know, the one hovering around single digits. then look at the purchase price of the horse and let me know when you find one that isn't 6 figures or higher. those are the only numbers you need for this conversation.
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Post by hesnotmypres on May 12, 2014 6:40:59 GMT -5
Last year about half of his starters and winners were in New York at Belmont Park and Saratoga. And most of his other starters and winners were at Gulfstream Park, where he spends his winters and trains his horses at Palm Meadows. He doesn't stable many horses anywhere but in New York most of the year or Florida in the winter. Almost all horses he enters in races outside of those places are shipped in. This silliness that Pletcher doesn't see his horses is just that - silliness. He trains his horses "hands on" almost exclusively. It's common knowledge Pletcher sits at his Computer figuring out where his Horses should be entered the upcoming week. His Dad does all the work at Palm Meadows. In fact his Dad has quite the eye for horses. Todd ONLY over sees his "A" team. As I stated his assistants are some of the best. He does win 23-25% on a weekly basis true, but his stats on big days (BC,Derby) are LESS than 7% ...
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2014 11:25:09 GMT -5
No trainers with a significant number of starters in the Breeders' Cup have had a high average % of winners. The highest is Richard Mandella at 21%.
Asmussen - 4 winners in 32 starters - 12% Baffert - 10 winners in 83 starters - 12% Frankel - 6 winners in 82 starters - 7% Lukas - 19 winners in 161 starters - 11% MacAnally - 4 winners in 31 starters - 12% McGaughey - 9 winners in 58 starters - 15% McLaughlin - 2 winners in 29 starters - 6% Mott - 9 winners in 77 starters - 11% Aiden O'Brien - 8 winners in 88 starters - 9% Pletcher - 7 winners in 103 starters - 7% Whittingham - 2 winners in 24 starters - 8% Zito - 2 winners in 37 starters - 5%
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Post by hesnotmypres on May 12, 2014 11:31:12 GMT -5
Lukas has a better winning % that sums it up perfectly.....
7% on Big days...25% on who cares days... He's a business man PERIOD...
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Jon
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Post by Jon on May 12, 2014 13:06:24 GMT -5
The man does something right to have the stable he has. Don't all trainers have to be "businessmen"?
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